burbuja

tonda_kavalec · January 19, 2011, 12:09pm

Hi there,

I am first time here, I live in Argentina and want to help with the spanish localization of Libre Office

sophi · January 19, 2011, 12:17pm

Hi Burbuja

Hi there,

I am first time here, I live in Argentina and want to help with the
spanish localization of Libre Office

So welcome to our list. Currently the translation in Spanish is already done by Santiago Bosio.
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language_Teams
But I'm sure he'll be happy to get your help
To help the team, you need to create an account for your language on Pootle here:
http://pootle.documentfoundation.org/
And then ask Santiago to give you some rights to be able to make suggestions.

Thanks for you support !

Kind regards
Sophie

timar · January 19, 2011, 12:21pm

Hi Burbuja

Hi there,

I am first time here, I live in Argentina and want to help with the
spanish localization of Libre Office

So welcome to our list. Currently the translation in Spanish is already done
by Santiago Bosio.

BTW, Santiago, can you please confirm this correction from Burbuja?

(12:37:51 PM) burbuja: Checking for an update failed
(12:38:08 PM) burbuja: string
(12:38:25 PM) burbuja: the correct translation would be: Checking for
an update failed. = Comprobación de las actualizaciones ha fallado.

Thanks,
Andras

Rimas_Kudelis · January 19, 2011, 3:46pm

2011.01.19 14:17, Sophie Gautier rašė:

Hi Burbuja

Hi there,

I am first time here, I live in Argentina and want to help with the
spanish localization of Libre Office

So welcome to our list. Currently the translation in Spanish is already done by Santiago Bosio.
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Language_Teams
But I'm sure he'll be happy to get your help
To help the team, you need to create an account for your language on Pootle here:
http://pootle.documentfoundation.org/
And then ask Santiago to give you some rights to be able to make suggestions.

Hm, I'm wondering if es_AR is any different from es. Maybe Tonda would like to head Argentinian Spanish localization?

Rimas

Roman_Gelbort · January 19, 2011, 5:06pm

Santiago Bosio is Argentinian!

He head es and es_AR projects.

sophi · January 19, 2011, 5:23pm

Hi all,

Hm, I'm wondering if es_AR is any different from es. Maybe Tonda would
like to head Argentinian Spanish localization?

That would be a great idea

Rimas

Santiago Bosio is Argentinian!

He head es and es_AR projects.

I don't see such a project for LibreOffice, may be you are speaking about OpenOffice.org?
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Translation_for_3_3

Kind regards
Sophie

tonda_kavalec · January 19, 2011, 5:49pm

Well, I mean es_ar is not necessary at all. There are some differencies in conjugation known as voseísmo y they use other words for some things like: patatas vs. papas = potatoes but all argentinian understand spanish of Spain

Sophie Gautier wrote:

Rimas_Kudelis · January 19, 2011, 7:17pm

Hi Tonda,

2011.01.19 19:48, tonda kavalec rašė:

Well, I mean es_ar is not necessary at all. There are some differencies in conjugation known as voseísmo y they use other words for some things like: patatas vs. papas = potatoes but all argentinian understand spanish of Spain

It's up to you, of course. But I also have a counter-example: it's probably same to assume that Brits understand Americans very well (and vice-versa), but they still have an en_GB localization project. You will probably not find the word "potatoe" in LibO's interface, but if the applicable terminology, grammar, or anything else differs, you may still want to have a separate localization project. But again, it's up to you and Santiago. I don't speak Spanish. ( )

Best regards,
Rimas

Xuacu · January 19, 2011, 7:18pm

Hi, Andras

Even if I'm not in the Spanish team, I think that such translation, even
if acceptable, it's not fully accurate.

burbuja uses a plural form (actualizaciones), while the original string
uses singular. My best guess would be "La búsqueda de una actualización
ha fallado" or, less literal, "No se encontró ninguna actualización"

And, please, excuse me if I stepped my neighbours' garden

Best regards

tonda_kavalec · January 19, 2011, 7:22pm

Hola, estoy de acuerdo con vos, lo mejor sería:

No se encontró ninguna actualización.

Xuacu wrote:

Xuacu · January 19, 2011, 8:28pm

Thank you, Tonda!

But, please, keep using English in this list to let everyone understand
us

Best regards,

sbosio · January 19, 2011, 8:48pm

Hi all,

First of all, currently I don't see the need for an es_AR specific translation because:

1) We try to keep a neutral spanish translation (and yet there's too much entries to be corrected), in order to be used by all 20 spanish locales (yes, there are too much of them!), this involves avoiding specific tenses, the argentinian "voseo" used on some locales of Central and South America, and the tenses corresponding to the second plural form "vosotros" used only at Spain. There are, however some terms that have some conflicts like the translation of 'file', because spanish people (from Spain) prefer the translation 'fichero', and all others are used to translate it 'archivo'.

2) Most important, we don't have that many collaborators to be able to maintain two separate translations, even if both share the vast majority of the strings.

Regarding the correction sent by burbuja, I can confirm that yes, it is horribly translated, but one problem arises here: the string is found on OOo's Pootle, not in LibO specific strings. It was corrected already on OOo's Pootle server like this: "Falló la búsqueda de actualizaciones." Both proposed translations were not very suitable, because "Comprobación de las actualizaciones ha fallado." has style problems (it's a too literal translation from english, and uses passive voice, which spanish should avoid whenever possible), and "No se encontró ninguna actualización." doesn't represents what the english string states (it's too liberal, because the application failed when searching for updates, and the translation implies that the search succeded, but no update was found, and there's another string for that situation).

Best regards,

Santiago

Alexandro_Colorado · January 19, 2011, 9:19pm

Hola, estoy de acuerdo con vos, lo mejor sería:

No se encontró ninguna actualización.

Xuacu wrote:

(12:37:51 PM) burbuja: Checking for an update failed

(12:38:08 PM) burbuja: string
(12:38:25 PM) burbuja: the correct translation would be: Checking for
an update failed. = Comprobación de las actualizaciones ha fallado.

Thanks,
Andras

Hi all,

First of all, currently I don't see the need for an es_AR specific
translation because:

1) We try to keep a neutral spanish translation (and yet there's too much
entries to be corrected), in order to be used by all 20 spanish locales
(yes, there are too much of them!), this involves avoiding specific tenses,
the argentinian "voseo" used on some locales of Central and South America,
and the tenses corresponding to the second plural form "vosotros" used only
at Spain. There are, however some terms that have some conflicts like the
translation of 'file', because spanish people (from Spain) prefer the
translation 'fichero', and all others are used to translate it 'archivo'.

A second issue arises which is the risk of breaking documentation. Changing
the UI will break tutorials and guides since the options/strings will change
between different sub-locales of Spanish. This will be a nightmare to
maintain since you don't write to an Argentinian Spanish vs a Mexican one.
Even worst when we start thinking on a regional locale and start generating
multiple locales within same country (southern mexico spanish vs capital
city spanish vs norteño).

Note that there has been done locales 'just for fun', and there was a
Klingon (Star trek) and Pig latin locales, but like Santiago said, we want
to make the most out our efforts with the skewed resources we have.

tonda_kavalec · January 19, 2011, 9:24pm

Sorry, but there is no "passive voice" in the sentence, and it is not even possible to create it from the verb fallar.

passive voice would be: Actualización no fue encontrada or no ha sido encontrada.

"Comprobación
> de las actualizaciones ha fallado." has style problems (it's a too
> literal translation from english, and uses passive voice, which spanish
> should avoid whenever possible), and "No se encontró ninguna
> actualización."

Santiago Bosio wrote:

tonda_kavalec · January 19, 2011, 9:28pm

First of all it should be a good understandable translation, it does not matter if literal or not. Neither is worth the discussion about such a simple thing.

Not always the original english string is excelent to defend it in every case.

Alexandro Colorado wrote:

Rimas_Kudelis · January 19, 2011, 9:52pm

Hello,

2011.01.19 23:23, tonda kavalec rašė:

Sorry, but there is no "passive voice" in the sentence, and it is not even possible to create it from the verb fallar.

passive voice would be: Actualización no fue encontrada or no ha sido encontrada.

Guys, if you have a Spanish mailing list, I think you should discuss this there. After all, you are the only ones who have the authority to decide on this matter.

Best regards,
Rimas

Jesus_Corrius · January 20, 2011, 12:42am

Hola, estoy de acuerdo con vos, lo mejor sería:

No se encontró ninguna actualización.

Xuacu wrote:

(12:37:51 PM) burbuja: Checking for an update failed
(12:38:08 PM) burbuja: string
(12:38:25 PM) burbuja: the correct translation would be: Checking for
an update failed. = Comprobación de las actualizaciones ha fallado.

Thanks,
Andras

Hi all,

First of all, currently I don't see the need for an es_AR specific
translation because:

1) We try to keep a neutral spanish translation (and yet there's too much
entries to be corrected), in order to be used by all 20 spanish locales
(yes, there are too much of them!), this involves avoiding specific tenses,
the argentinian "voseo" used on some locales of Central and South America,
and the tenses corresponding to the second plural form "vosotros" used only
at Spain. There are, however some terms that have some conflicts like the
translation of 'file', because spanish people (from Spain) prefer the
translation 'fichero', and all others are used to translate it 'archivo'.

Most software in Spanish (Spain) translate "file" as "archivo" and I
have never heard anyone complain about this.

2) Most important, we don't have that many collaborators to be able to
maintain two separate translations, even if both share the vast majority of
the strings.

Regarding the correction sent by burbuja, I can confirm that yes, it is
horribly translated, but one problem arises here: the string is found on
OOo's Pootle, not in LibO specific strings. It was corrected already on
OOo's Pootle server like this: "Falló la búsqueda de actualizaciones." Both
proposed translations were not very suitable, because "Comprobación de las
actualizaciones ha fallado." has style problems (it's a too literal
translation from english, and uses passive voice, which spanish should avoid
whenever possible), and "No se encontró ninguna actualización." doesn't
represents what the english string states (it's too liberal, because the
application failed when searching for updates, and the translation implies
that the search succeded, but no update was found, and there's another
string for that situation).

"Ha fallado la comprobación de actualizaciones"

Roman_Gelbort · January 20, 2011, 2:46am

clap, clap, clap

Please, Tonda, add to the spanish translation team!

This skills even are necessaries.