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Dear Ladies and Gentlemen out there.
I am confused -- can you help me? I recently installed LibreOffice-v3.4.5 after beeing a happy OO-user in many many years. I now need to make a couple of relational databases (subforms &-reports) and decided to try LibreO's Base. On my main-PC (AMD Athlon II X3 445, Win7Prof/32bit) the LO's Base caused the program to stop (Write&Calc work OK). I uninstalled LO, removed folders via WinExplorer, rebooted, installed LOv3.4.5 again and when asked for a new JRE I tried to understand the instructions found and first installed JRE8 (jre-8-ea-bin-b21-windows-i586-13_jan_2012.exe) and then JRE7 (jre-7u2-windows-i586.exe) and loaded both as instructed into LO (LO-page: tools/options/LibreOffice/java). Now LO didn't stop but neither of the JREs seem to be sufficient /"LibreO requires a JRE to perform this task. The selected JRE is defective. Please select and install a new JRE/" and then "/connection to datasource ("db-name") could not be established -- no Java installation could be found; check installation/". I did my best several times.
Note. After doing exactly same install process on my laptop (Win7Prem/64bit) the LO(64bit), Base included, works fine.
Did I do something wrong, wrong versions, is it the 32bit make of LO or the LO-Base itself, is the JRE(32bit) wrong, -- or what? I like the graphical interface but I don't want to go back to OO and I don't want to buy a MSAccess, and for my simple needs a MySQL/PHP/Apache seems too heavy to learn.
Thanks in advance.
Pepe Rönnberg (Finland)
Hi Pertti,
(LO-page: tools/options/LibreOffice/java). Now LO didn't stop but
neither of the JREs seem to be sufficient /"LibreO requires a JRE to
perform this task. The selected JRE is defective. Please select and
install a new JRE/" and then "/connection to datasource ("db-name")
could not be established -- no Java installation could be found; check
installation/". I did my best several times.
Yes, the dependency on Java JRE/JDK is a pain in the backside, but
unfortunately unavoidable if you want to use Base, at least for the time
being.
Note. After doing exactly same install process on my laptop
(Win7Prem/64bit) the LO(64bit), Base included, works fine.
Did I do something wrong, wrong versions, is it the 32bit make of LO or
the LO-Base itself, is the JRE(32bit) wrong, -- or what? I like the
Even on 64bit Windows OSes, you must use a 32bit Java JRE or JDK, a
64bit version won't work. You may well have installed 64bit versions of
the JRE by mistake, but there was also a problem with recognition of JRE
1.7 by LibreOffice, and this was supposed to be fixed - perhaps it isn't
yet in LO 3.4.5. I didn't even know JRE 1.8 was out, so that will
probably not work either. If you can, try and find a 32bit JRE 1.6 to
download and use instead, that should work.
Alex
Am 31.01.2012 19:31, Pertti Rönnberg wrote:
and for my simple needs a MySQL/PHP/Apache seems too
heavy to learn.
Well, then you will never be able to use Base neither. Base is extremely simple. If you can not work with simplified database tools, Base can't help you by any means.
The main purpos of Base is connecting office documents to databases so you can feed your calculation models, serial letters and bibliographies with database data. This is straight forward and simple enough.
But Base does not help you to plan a relational database nor does it help very much creating one. Most of the wizards and graphical design tools are buggy or incomplete at least.
Am 31.01.2012 20:16, Alexander Thurgood wrote:
Yes, the dependency on Java JRE/JDK is a pain in the backside, but
unfortunately unavoidable if you want to use Base, at least for the time
being.
With no Java being installed, I can connect a Base document to any non-Java database, write queries, draw input forms and use Calc as reporting engine.
Hi :
i would go with Andreas' suggestion. An external back-end but finding a small non-Java-dependant one might be tricky. MySql and it's fork (successor?) MariaDb are probably too heavy. Is Postgresql better for smaller databases?
If you have to have java then the best one seems to be 6u21. If you can get it all working with a newer version then great but past the 6u24 they seem to cause increasing problems. I was really hoping that 3.5.x would allow people to use java 7. I didn't realise there was already an 8!! Has 7 already been found to have serious security issues?
Regards from
Tom 
Hi :
i would go with Andreas' suggestion. An external back-end but finding a small non-Java-dependant one might be tricky. MySql and it's fork (successor?) MariaDb are probably too heavy. Is Postgresql better for smaller databases?
A small database back-end that might be suitable is SQLite. Personally I prefer MySQL/MariaDB over Postgresql because more third-party documentation is available and I think Postgresql is heavier.
Hi
Last i heard the Postgresql people were working more closely with Base than the MariaDb people who seem to be busy with their own side of things. No word at all from the MySql community. The MySql connector apparently works with MariaDb or at least we have never had anyone grumbling about it.
I keep forgetting about SQLite. It sounds likely to be light but is it free of java?
Regards from
Tom
Hi
Last i heard the Postgresql people were working more closely with Base than the MariaDb people who seem to be busy with their own side of things. No word at all from the MySql community. The MySql connector apparently works with MariaDb or at least we have never had anyone grumbling about it.
MariaDB is designed as a drop-in replacement for MySQL. It uses the same file names as MySQL so programs/apps that depend on MySQL should not break when switching to MariaDB.
I keep forgetting about SQLite. It sounds likely to be light but is it free of java?
According to Wikipedia it is written in C
Hi Andreas,
Am 31.01.2012 20:16, Alexander Thurgood wrote:
Yes, the dependency on Java JRE/JDK is a pain in the backside, but
unfortunately unavoidable if you want to use Base, at least for the time
being.With no Java being installed, I can connect a Base document to any
non-Java database, write queries, draw input forms and use Calc as
reporting engine.
And I would state that that is an "unusual" user setup. The user here wants a relational database with subforms and reports and does not want to use mysql, so where does that leave him her with regard to Base - IMO, with HSQLDB, the stock db engine provided with LO. For that, you need a JRE/JDK.
And Calc for reports is OK, much as is Writer, but for anything a bit more than a simple report, the user will have to deal with not only the idiosyncrasies of the respective tool used for creating the report, plus, in general, learn to use macros. The whole benefit of having a specific reporting tool (the Java based ORB extension) is that this is suppose to ease that pain.
Personally, I'd love to be able to say, you get a great and easy to use db reporting engine without Java in LO, but that is simply not the case at the moment.
Alex
Am 01.02.2012 08:43, Alex Thurgood wrote:
And I would state that that is an "unusual" user setup. The user here
wants a relational database with subforms and reports and does not want
to use mysql, so where does that leave him her with regard to Base -
IMO, with HSQLDB, the stock db engine provided with LO. For that, you
need a JRE/JDK.
And we all know why one must not use the built-in HSQLDB for productive databases. The so called "Base document" with its built-in HSQLDB is the most horrible face-palm feature since OOo 2.0.
And Calc for reports is OK, much as is Writer, but for anything a bit
more than a simple report, the user will have to deal with not only the
idiosyncrasies of the respective tool used for creating the report,
plus, in general, learn to use macros. The whole benefit of having a
specific reporting tool (the Java based ORB extension) is that this is
suppose to ease that pain.
I hardly ever use any macros at all. I simply use Calc's database ranges with registered data sources as they are intended to be used.
Without a single line of macro code I open a document through a hyperlink button on a form, confirm a dialog to refresh unsaved import ranges and get a brand new collection of nicely formatted reports and charts.
Personally, I'd love to be able to say, you get a great and easy to use
db reporting engine without Java in LO, but that is simply not the case
at the moment.
Calc provides all kinds of calculations and charting based on dynamically changing import ranges (much better than with spreadsheet data). Data pilots provide a second type of database report.
Things do simply *work* with Calc as report engine. If things really *work*, I don't care too much about the perfect look.
All of you.
Thanks very much for your kindness to bother answering - and for the very interesting discussions.
My conclusion is that LO-Base (and OO-Base ?) is not yet - and perhaps will not be as mentioned in the desciption at LO-Wikipedia: "A database management program <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Database_management_program>, similar to Microsoft Access .. etc" <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Access>.
Its really pity because I think the usability of databases is underrated; quite ordinary people should have plenty of use of databases in their every day life if there only were free, easy installed, easy customized templates and some efforts on marketing. I just got a fancy idea that LO-/OO-Base could be that user-friendly solution.
Anyway, I still feel it worth trying to see if there should be a way to get my 32bit LO-Base working!
I agree. I am a 72 years "oldtimer" with a pure interest to keep up. When in office until about 10 years ago I worked quite a lot with MSAccess and VBA & macros and got somewhat familiar with SQL too. MSAccess alone was enough for quite complicated projects with informative forms/reports and analyses.
So now it is not the MySQL/SQLite, it is the PHP-language and getting the MySQL/PHP/Apache combination working that I feel uncomfortable - I also have tried WASP.
Again - thanks and all the best!
Pertti Rönnberg
Hi
A big
+1
Regards from
Tom
Am 01.02.2012 19:36, Pertti Rönnberg wrote:
All of you.
Thanks very much for your kindness to bother answering - and for the
very interesting discussions.My conclusion is that LO-Base (and OO-Base ?) is not yet - and perhaps
will not be as mentioned in the desciption at LO-Wikipedia: "A database
management program
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Database_management_program>, similar to
Microsoft Access .. etc" <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Access>.
The difference amounts to a multi-million Dollar budget and a decade of development. OOo Base was maintained by 2 Sun/Oracle employees.
It is similar to Access. Access is named Access because you can access databases with it. In *addition* Access provides the JET database engine which embeds a database backend in the frontend file. Unfortunately, most people work with JET which is why Access has a bad reputation among professionals. I've seen very nice Access frontends for MySQL databases.
Base connects ODF documents with databases. In *addition* it can embed a HSQLDB into the frontend file which is basically a zip archive with configuration and Writer documents. Unfortunately, most people use the embedded HSQLDB which is why Base has such a bad reputation.
If you ever had created some relational database backend using any database specific, mature tool for the database, you would acknowledge how straight-forward Base connects your database with this office suite.
Simply do your database with a database program. Base is not a database program.
Is this a "Windows" problem? I'm not having any problems using Base
with the Ubuntu O/S. My java is openjdk-6-jre. This java is supplied by
from Ubuntu's repositories. I don't know, but I suspect that this java
version can also be used for other Linux distributions.
This java's description: Full Java runtime environment - needed for
executing Java GUI and Webstart programs. Using Hotspot JIT. The
packages are built using the IcedTea build support and patches from the
IcedTea project. (Maybe someone else understands this jargon.)
I wonder about some of the comments that have been made in this
thread. What I do know is that OOo 3.3 (or perhaps earlier) contained a
method to disable the Base Wizard. The word at the time was that there
were large companies wanting to control who in their company could
create .odb files (database document files) at work. These companies
were told what configuration file had to be changed from what to what.
I realize that the security holes found in java has been a
problem. I seem to have seen somewhere that the java based upon the
IcedTea project does not have these holes.
I use Base for embedded databases that are flat, relational, one
that is a combination of flat and relational I have one .odb file that
links to a spreadsheet. They all work.
"Base Tutorial: From Newbie to Advocate in a one, two... three!" by
Mariano Casanova
written for OOo (publication date: August 2010. This is a fairly
sophisticated application created using Base.
Here is a link that is a Base Tutorial which is a online course for
Base. The estimated time required to go through this tutorial is more
than 60 hours.
http://www.fhi.rcsed.ac.uk/rbeaumont/virtualclassroom/chap8/libreoffice_base.html
In other words, I think there is more to Base than I seem to be
reading in this and other threads.
--Dan
Hi again,
First Tom:
I will try. Let us see what comes from the deeps of my mind and if I can find some old projects to investigate so I can give an understandable answer - I'm a little afraid that not.
Andreas:
Thank you for very interesting info. Please note that I am talking from a consumers point of view in no way professional in databases. When I worked with MSAccess I plainly saw it as a program - a tool - and tried to learn how to get it producing the needed results, how to do data input - data mixing and processing - data output.
The background philosophy and programming details were of no interest - I did not even know to ask. Knowing could have been of help.
I am aware of what you say about "real" relational dbs; my intention is to do the ODBC connection (or JDBC if necessary) between LO-Base and (e.g.) MySQL but if I'm correct the LO-Base (32bit) must first start working stable with or without a JRE.
That's why I now put my question "how" to your admirable community.
Best regards
Pepe
Hi
There are Mac and GNu&Linux connectors for MySql / MariaDb but not a Windows one yet
http://extensions.libreoffice.org/extension-center/mysql-native-connector-for-mac-osx
If you do build a Windows one it would be fantastic if you could upload it to the Extensions site for other people to use.
I'm not sure where to find the source code. Hopefully it's pretty obvious.
Regards from
Tom
Hi Dan
OpenJDK is also owned by Oracle but that might be mitigated by having a community involved. I'm not sure if normal java has a community too. Ubuntu 10.04LTS has java 6_20 by default at the moment. Perhaps you also have one of the good (at least for LO) versions such as 6_21 or 6_22.
The creator of the course you gave a link to just emailed me moments before you posted and said that is a back-up and the better site is
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/9113961/virtualclassroom/chap8/libreoffice_base.html
It looks a lot nicer! Same content i guess but looks can count for a lot sometimes
Regards from
Tom
Hi
I think it's a classic case of something that is so nearly perfect and with such huge potential and clever, uncompromising concept. It's even more frustrating than some broken heap of junk precisely because it's so close but misses (in the fairly rare cases when it does miss). Most people seem to have no troubles with it but for a few it's like scratching finger-nails down a black-board.
Regards from
Tom
Am 01.02.2012 19:36, Pertti Rönnberg wrote:
All of you.
Thanks very much for your kindness to bother answering - and for the
very interesting discussions.My conclusion is that LO-Base (and OO-Base ?) is not yet - and perhaps
will not be as mentioned in the desciption at LO-Wikipedia: "A database
management program
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Database_management_program>, similar to
Microsoft Access .. etc" <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Access>.The difference amounts to a multi-million Dollar budget and a decade of development. OOo Base was maintained by 2 Sun/Oracle employees.
It is similar to Access. Access is named Access because you can access databases with it. In *addition* Access provides the JET database engine which embeds a database backend in the frontend file. Unfortunately, most people work with JET which is why Access has a bad reputation among professionals. I've seen very nice Access frontends for MySQL databases.
We use LO base and MySQL also with very nice results