inserting (exactly) a line before a paragraph using styles

users
#1

Hi,

Firstly, thanks for all the replies about my blank page question. That is
all working nicely, however, I am now stuck trying to get writer to insert
a blank line before a paragraph. It is important it is *exactly* a line as
otherwise the baseline of the text on the opposite page won't line up.
Using 'spacing above paragraph' and trial and error I can get very close to
adding a line, but if the font or font size changes this will break.

Even a formula for working out the 'spacing above paragraph' would be a
massive help (I've tried just using the point size of the font but this
doesn't work :frowning: ) or perhaps there is a 'snap to baseline' option somewhere?

In case you're wondering why I don't just hit return to get my extra line,
I am trying to create master copies of my books using LO so that I can use
export to PDF for the print version and export to xhtml for the ebook
formats. For this to work all the layout needs to be done using styles.

Thanks,

Rob

#2

Hi Rob,

rob wood schrieb:

Hi,

Firstly, thanks for all the replies about my blank page question. That is
all working nicely, however, I am now stuck trying to get writer to insert
a blank line before a paragraph. It is important it is *exactly* a line as
otherwise the baseline of the text on the opposite page won't line up.

Aligning baselines are not done by inserting a line, but by using the feature "Register true".

Kind regards
Regina

#3

Regina Henschel wrote:

Hi Rob,

rob wood schrieb:

Hi,

Firstly, thanks for all the replies about my blank page question. That is
all working nicely, however, I am now stuck trying to get writer to insert
a blank line before a paragraph. It is important it is *exactly* a line as
otherwise the baseline of the text on the opposite page won't line up.

Aligning baselines are not done by inserting a line, but by using the feature "Register
true".

Kind regards
Regina

       This is a very nice thing to know. I did not know it was possible.

       Using the Page style to select this feature:
1) Right click the page style being used.
2) Select Modify.
3) Click the Page tab.
4) "Register true" has a check box (tick box?) which is third down in the Layout section.

--Dan

#4

Thanks, spent all morning trying to get that to work :slight_smile:

The only problem I have left is that where I have set the very first
character of the very first paragraph to be 50% bigger than everything
else, with register true turned on, this causes an extra blank line to be
added beneath the first line. This enlarged letter has been done with a
character style. Any ideas on how this can be fixed (other than removing
the big capital or turning off register true)?

#5

rob wood wrote:

Thanks, spent all morning trying to get that to work :slight_smile:

The only problem I have left is that where I have set the very first
character of the very first paragraph to be 50% bigger than everything
else, with register true turned on, this causes an extra blank line to be
added beneath the first line. This enlarged letter has been done with a
character style. Any ideas on how this can be fixed (other than removing
the big capital or turning off register true)?

      This is known as a Drop cap.
      As a style, create a new paragraph style that is linked with the paragraph style you are presently using. Use the DropCap tab (page) of the new paragraph style to set the characteristics you want.

--Dan

#6

This isn't quite the same, I don't want the capital to go down into the
other lines (a drop cap) I want it to have the same baseline as the rest of
the text like this (if you're viewing this in html mode):

The first letter is bigger than the rest...
This is the second line...

However, if I try to do this in libreoffice with register true turned on,
it is doing this:

The first letter is bigger than the rest...
[this gap appears]
This is the second line...

Interestingly using drop caps doesn't work quite right either with register
true turned on. It makes a two line drop cap too tall (that is to say, it
goes down two lines, like it should, but also up a line).

#7

I have in fact wondered what "Register true" was for, thanks for that info.

The question that next comes up in my mind is, does anyone know where in the world did a "name" like that come from? If it were me naming that feature I would of called it something like... "Align Baselines".

Is there a story or reason behind it? If it's not a good one, I vote for changing the name, because in 6 months or a year I'll have forgotten what it does (chances are slim I'll ever have to use that feature but still). I'm a big fan of naming things after their functions if and when it makes sense to do so.

Thank you in advance.

#8

Andrew Brager wrote:

Aligning baselines are not done by inserting a line, but by using the feature "Register
true".

Kind regards
Regina

I have in fact wondered what "Register true" was for, thanks for that info.

The question that next comes up in my mind is, does anyone know where in the world did a
"name" like that come from? If it were me naming that feature I would of called it
something like... "Align Baselines".

Is there a story or reason behind it? If it's not a good one, I vote for changing the
name, because in 6 months or a year I'll have forgotten what it does (chances are slim
I'll ever have to use that feature but still). I'm a big fan of naming things after their
functions if and when it makes sense to do so.

Thank you in advance.

      Use LO's help to search for this term. It answers your question. Hint, it has to do with how newspapers have been printed.

--Dan

#9

Hi Rob,

rob wood schrieb:

This isn't quite the same, I don't want the capital to go down into the
other lines (a drop cap) I want it to have the same baseline as the rest of
the text like this (if you're viewing this in html mode):

The first letter is bigger than the rest...
This is the second line...

However, if I try to do this in libreoffice with register true turned on,
it is doing this:

The first letter is bigger than the rest...
[this gap appears]
This is the second line...

I don't know, why the gap appears. If I set the text-to-text alignment to bottom, it should not be there.

Interestingly using drop caps doesn't work quite right either with register
true turned on. It makes a two line drop cap too tall (that is to say, it
goes down two lines, like it should, but also up a line).

You can use drop cap. Write the first character, then write a "Shift+Enter" line feed and then the rest of the word. Then the space which is needed is above the paragraph.

Kind regards
Regina

#10

Well, I've realised why it is doing it. As the first letter is bigger, it
is making the bottom line of that line of text go lower, meaning the second
line doesn't have the space to go where it normally would, but because
register true is on, rather than just going marginally lower it has to skip
down another line. I can over rule this by setting the line-width to fixed
at some value less than a normal line (as register true overrules the fixed
line width), but this mucks up the exported xhtml. The annoying thing is
that because the first letter is always a capital there is no need for the
bottom line to change.

Using the Drop Cap and line feeds also mucks up the exported xhtml.

:frowning:

#11

Oops meant line *spacing* not line width.

#12

Andrew, I so agree; it's so frustrating trying to remember the inane
naming of some things;
           and let's abolish the use of double entendre acronyms as well.

#13

Dan, you've been mis-informed re. newspapers.

Andrew Brager wrote:

#14

"Register-true is a typography term that is used in printing. This term refers to the congruent imprint of the lines within a type area on the front and the back side of book pages, newspaper pages and magazine pages. The register-true feature make these pages easier to read by preventing gray shadows from shining through between the lines of text. The register-true term also refers to lines in adjacent text columns that are of the same height.

When you define a paragraph, Paragraph Style, or a Page Style as register-true, the base lines of the affected characters are aligned to a vertical page grid, regardless of font size or of the presence of graphics. If you want, you can specify the setting for this grid as a Page Style property."

True to traditional Unix man-page form, it makes perfect sense - once you read somebody else's explanation somewhere else as to what it means. Failing that, re-reading it a few dozen times very slowly helps a bit. I still vote for "Align Baselines" and damn the people still using the Gutenberg press.

#15

anne-ology wrote:

        Dan, you've been mis-informed re. newspapers.

  Are you sure?: http://help.libreoffice.org/Writer/Printing_Register-true

--Dan

#16

Andrew, you're referring to post-computers :wink:

#17

newspapers were pre-computers therefore pre-LO :wink:

anne-ology wrote:

#18

Strange, it seems that you did not read what is contained in the link above nor does it seem that you searched for the term in LO's help. It has noting to do with what predates what. Well you would know this if you had done your assignment. This term is in current use today.
      So what is this strike 2, or is it strike 3, you're out? :wink:

--Dan

#19

Dan or anyone else,

Without meaning to fan the flames, can you provide another citation outside of LO that supports the theory espoused? I tried, I was unable to find anything. I'm sure it's probably true, but I'm from Missouri when it comes to some things. (For those that don't know, Missouri is nicknamed the "show me" state.)

#20

That "register true" is for "adjust to baseline" or whatever?

Take any book about typography. I can cite at least three different book titles
from memory that will support it. But they are all in Polish, so I doubt they
will be much of use here.